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Advice Please!

Last post 20/09/08 at 08:47 by redback, 12 replies
Post started by lil_irish_eyes on 13/09/08 at 11:57

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    Posted by: lil_irish_eyes 13/09/2008 at 11:57
    Joined on 02/02/2005
    Posts 1,160

    Hi all,

     

    I am hoping you can help! I have a Year 9 class who, by and large, are absolutely lovely. However, there is one child in there who is determined to destroy every lesson I have with him. He does it all round the school and I don't know a single teacher who knows how to deal with him.

     He is ALWAYS talking or making comments about other students. Although he does complete work ( or at least some of it) he doesn't listen when the teacher is talking and pays little attention. I think he is a very smart kid and I also think he has ADHD but he hasn't been diagnosed with it. His behaviour is not very serious, it's just very bad low-level and i'm finding it hard to keep track of him and make sure he doesn't destroy my lessons. He also enjoys winding up a little aspergic boy in the class which causes mayhem.  

    Anyone got any advice as to how I can keep this boy quiet or ensure he is occuplied enough not to distract. My lessons ar always fast-moving and I use both visual, auditory and kinaesthetic learning in them so I don't know quite what to do!

     

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    Posted by: brettgirl2 13/09/2008 at 12:09
    Joined on 09/01/2005
    Posts 3,148

     I think you need to be firmer with him, rather than trying to pander to his needs.  Put him in detention, phone home, then park with another class until he is willing to behave in a way that you find acceptable.  Whether the behaviour is low level or not if you think it is unacceptable then you mustn't put up with it - if you do then it will spread to others.  It is also extremely unfair on the boy with Aspergers.

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    Posted by: myteachingtrials 16/09/2008 at 18:21
    Joined on 11/09/2008
    Posts 9

    This is not unusual for one student to destroy the class for everyone else. Kids dont just misbehave he must be doing this for a reason. Maybe he isnt getting enough attention at home?  in order to get the ball rolling id begin by documenting his behaviour.  I would draw on the help of your heads of year and flag him up early.  In order to get an ADHD diagnosis documentation will be needed anyway. You need to identify the exact behaviour that are causing concern.  What reward does he get by acting liek this?

    Dont put up with chronic low level misbehaviour.  work with your head of year to have 'out' strategies so that if you have given him ample warnings then you can send him somewhere.  consistency is the key here if you start letting him get away with little things like saying unkind things to kids in his class then it sets a precedence for others int eh class be polite and remain calm.  Tell him he has a choice over how he behaves and if he chooses to not follow the class rules then he there will be consequences.  when giving him warnings remind him of the class rule he is breaking.

     parents need to be brought in asap to help with the solution. Its often a sad fact in my experience that parents are part of the problem but nevertheless they need to be involved. Id begin by digging deeper into why he doest engage.

     Lastly i think teaching is about building relationships. Talk to him and explan the probem you have with him.  respect goes a long way in situations like this.  Like the old saying goes be firm but fair.

     

     

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    Posted by: oldskool71 16/09/2008 at 21:32
    Joined on 05/07/2008
    Posts 253

    If he is " doing it all round the school" there needs to be a whole school foucs on his behaviour. Discuss his behaviour with his tutor and HOY. Do you have a report system?

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    Posted by: SueCowley 17/09/2008 at 13:21
    Joined on 29/08/2003
    Posts 57

    Lots of good advice given so far.

    These kind of kids are often playing up to their peer group to get a response.  So, I'd say some clear warnings and then he's out with some work.  If he is sent out, see if you can arrange for him to be put into either a class much younger than his peer group (i.e. Yr.7) or one much older (i.e. Yr.11/12/13).  That way he should hopefully be in a situation where it won't be tempting to play up because he's too embarrassed.

     Hope that helps.  At least it's only the one that's giving you grief.

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    Posted by: oldandrew 18/09/2008 at 18:29
    Joined on 08/01/2006
    Posts 5,568

    myteachingtrials:
    Kids dont just misbehave he must be doing this for a reason.
     

    Have you ever met a child?

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    Posted by: brettgirl2 18/09/2008 at 19:14
    Joined on 09/01/2005
    Posts 3,148

    Well, to be fair that is true - if a kid misbehaves because they are a little g.it then there is still a reason for it!

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    Posted by: myteachingtrials 18/09/2008 at 19:56
    Joined on 11/09/2008
    Posts 9

    I do know what you mean old and new i have felt the same way about particular kids.  Just saying that the kid is inately mischevious or bad isnt going to fix the problem.  You need to look at it from a few angles to find a solution.  I am not there and i dont know the kid so i guess like everyone i can only go on past experience when dealing with difficult kids.

     Im a big supporter of a guy named William Glasser who has this "Choice Theory" its similar to Maslows hierachy of needs in that behaviour is driven by a need to fulfil a particular need.  This guy Glasser states that there are four fundamental psychological needs.

    This next bit is cut from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choice_theory

    • Belonging/connecting/love
    • Power/significance
    • Freedom/responsibility, and
    • Fun/learning

     Basically the child consciously of unconsciously is in a constant drive to fullfil these needs.  check out the link and it goes into more detail. It is worth a look if nothing else.  The other great thing Glasser has produced is his Axioms of behaviour. 

    The Ten Axioms of Choice Theory

    1. The only person whose behavior we can control is our own.
    2. All we can give another person is information.
    3. All long-lasting psychological problems are relationship problems.
    4. The problem relationship is always part of our present life.
    5. What happened in the past has everything to do with what we are today, but we can only satisfy our basic needs right now and plan to continue satisfying them in the future.
    6. We can only satisfy our needs by satisfying the pictures in our Quality World.
    7. All we do is behave.
    8. All behavior is Total Behavior and is made up of four components: acting, thinking, feeling and physiology
    9. All Total Behavior is chosen, but we only have direct control over the acting and thinking components. We can only control our feeling and physiology indirectly through how we choose to act and think.
    10. All Total Behavior is designated by verbs and named by the part that is the most recognizable.

     

    OK AFTER READING SO FAR YOU ARE NOT CONVINCED

     

    Have a look at a functional assessment of behaviour.

    http://cecp.air.org/fba/

    http://cecp.air.org/fba/problembehavior/necessary.htm

     

     

    STILL NOT CONVINCED

     

    check out medical models for behaviour. These look at behaviour from a medical point of view point and incorporates things like ADHD and learning difficulties as causes for misbehaviour.

     

     

    If you are still caught in the pessimistic cycle of believing in inate misbehaviour then maybe a career change.  Apologies for sounding rude but i believe the old saying "if you're not part of the solution then your part of the problem"

     

    I will end this post by saying that im not the best teacher in the world but im one who never gives up!

     

     

     

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    Posted by: oldandrew 18/09/2008 at 22:17
    Joined on 08/01/2006
    Posts 5,568

    myteachingtrials:
    Just saying that the kid is inately mischevious or bad isnt going to fix the problem. 
     

    I'm not saying it to fix the problem, I am saying it because it is true. People do bad things for no good reason. And this isn't a frustrated statement about naughty kids it's a fact about human beings generally.This is a problem that we are not going to solve. We can't even change ourselves into saints through rational principles let alone other people.

    Please don't start throwing psychological models at me. I don't need a scientific model of the human mind to understand doing wrong. I actually have a mind (complete with weaknesses and susceptibility to temptation).of my own. A quick study of my own mind (and those minds of those around me) suggests that people think, feel and do bad things.Trying to suggest personal reasons for an individual sinning is like trying to suggest reasons that someone might inhale oxygen or bleed red.

    Oh, and people only need things for a purpose. Even air we only need in order to live. Give up on living and we don't need it any more. Talk of human beings having "needs" divorced from specific purposes is nonsense. So even if a psychological model of behaviour was necessary, one based on needs would be utterly inadequate.

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    Posted by: mountainpaddy 18/09/2008 at 22:55
    Joined on 01/04/2007
    Posts 1,466

    This may cause some howls of protest - its a last ditch strategy

    Known pain in the rear end, everyone inc the kids fed up with the disruption, student has reached the "untouchable" status, smt have virtually given up, parents blame the teachers.

    As soon as it's clear that the student is going to be disruptive give a clear warning that

    a) the whole group will be doing something boring like copying from 30 year old text books, in silence, whilst the bad behaviour is dealt with, give out the books and start them off.

    b) any student in the group who laughs at or interacts with the disruptive student gets 100 lines and will be on my bad list for a long time.

    c) the disruptive student is sent out of the room or to HOD with a DT or whatever passess for a punishment (DT etc)

    d) Make sure your mood changes completely when the student is gone, be extra enthuisastic and have some fun activities and gush praise on the other students

     

    This has worked more than it fails, the real upside is that frequently the students become vocal and start to bring the offender inline or ask for them to be removed.

    My biggest "success" was with a Y9 shemail from hell who ended up leaving my room not because I made her, but because the group made her, I never even raised my voice.

     

    I would much prefer the "success" to have been finding away into this young persons mindset and finding a way of getting her working and achieving, but I am a small part of the machine and if everyone else has given up I have to put the needs of the rest of my class (getting on with some learning) first.

    Good Luck

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